Journal of the House of Representatives
of the Second Session of the 110th General Assembly
of the State of South Carolina
being the Regular Session Beginning Tuesday, January 11, 1994

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| Printed Page 2630, Feb. 24 | Printed Page 2650, Feb. 24 |
Printed Page 2640 . . . . . Thursday, February 24, 1994
with deregulation, what would be the benefits of that that you would see and what would be the down side of that deregulation?
A. I don't know how to answer that question.
Q. Mr. Chairman, I would like to note for the record that we have reviewed Ms. Douglas's credit report and report from SLED. They were both positive in that there were no negative entries and conclude my questioning there. Thank you.
REPRESENTATIVE QUINN: Any questions from the committee? Representative Kennedy.
EXAMINATION BY REPRESENTATIVE KENNEDY:
Q. Ms. Douglas, let's see how I can phrase my question. I remember a few years ago when I got interested in politics, I decided to run for county council. In trying to make up my mind, I started attending the county council meetings down in my area and sat in the audience and listened to the debates and paid attention to what was going on and I did that a number of times and then I felt that I could probably do better than what those guys up there were doing, so I decided to run for county council and was successful.

My question to you is in making up your mind to run for the Public Service Commission, did you -- or have you attended any of their meetings and participated as an observer and what prompted your making a decision to run for the Public Service Commission?
A. To answer your first question, I have not attended any of the Public Service Commission meetings. And to be frank with you about my application to the Public Service Commission, when the ad came out in our local paper in Winnsboro, I thought that it was an advisory post position and I was willing to lend whatever skills that I had, whatever talent that I had to this process and to learn more about the Public Service Commission through that effort.

When I called to ask for the application packet and it was mailed, I received it and upon receipt of that packet, I didn't see in the body of that information where the meetings were held or how often they were held. And I called up Mr. Couick's office back and asked about the location of the meetings and I asked if there was any compensation for any travel. Because, here again, I was under the impression that this was an advisory post.

It was at that point in time that I learned from Mr. Couick that it was a paid salary position and when he told me what the salary was, I will have to tell you again that I almost fell over in the chair. I pursued conversations with individuals that had had some exposure to the Public

Printed Page 2641 . . . . . Thursday, February 24, 1994
Service Commission inquiring about what the responsibilities and roles of that commission were.

And at that point is when I decided that if I could do the work that I'm doing at Council on Aging and understand and carry out the mandates as they're given in the Older Americans Act and follow that financial and accounting responsibility, then I was pretty able -- I felt very confident that I could pursue this and bring to the table some of the many things that I have learned in the process at Council on Aging to the table in the decision making at the Public Service Commission.
Q. Just one more. Thank you very much. Just one more question. Ms. Douglas, tell me how do you feel about Affirmative Action? I don't know if I asked -- yes, that's my question. How do you feel about Affirmative Action?
A. I have always practiced treating people on level ground. I have never felt like I've had when I've interviewed and hired individuals that I look at them on the basis of skin color, gender, ethnic origin, whatever. I have taken them for their ability to do the job.
Q. Just one follow up --
A. And I'm not trying --
Q. I'm sorry.
A. I'm not trying to hedge the question. I don't know how to answer the question other than just how I answered it.
Q. Thank you.
REPRESENTATIVE QUINN: Senator Jackson.
EXAMINATION BY SENATOR JACKSON:
Q. Ms. Douglas, let me follow up on one question that Representative Kennedy asked and then I have one additional question. When -- what's the makeup of your current staff on the Council on Aging?
A. And that will probably better give you an idea of what our agency looks likes. In the administrative end, the administrative pool that we have consists of five individuals, three of those are minorities. In the Home Care Aid, Transportation Area, I really need -- I wish I had brought a pen that I could kind of figure this out. I wish I had this right before me.
Q. Just a round figure will be sufficient.
A. Okay. If the question that you're asking is how many minorities are employed in -- within our agency, there -- out of the 23, there are 12 or -- 12 or 13 that are minorities.
Q. The final question, have you ever heard of the term Informational Highway?
A. I haven't.

Printed Page 2642 . . . . . Thursday, February 24, 1994
Q. You would --
A. I --
Q. Informational Highway?
A. I'm not familiar with that.
Q. Okay. Are you familiar with the cable companies and the possibilities of the telephone companies going into the cable business? Have you heard of that?
A. I've -- I'm not -- don't know anything about that.
Q. Okay. Thank you.
EXAMINATION BY REPRESENTATIVE QUINN:
Q. Ms. Douglas, I see that in one of your letters of reference, you have the former State Senator Isadore Lourie who is chairman of my delegation or past chairman of my delegation. This brings to mind, have you contributed to any political candidates who currently serve in the General Assembly or worked on their campaigns?
A. I have not.
REPRESENTATIVE QUINN: Any other questions from the committee?
EXAMINATION BY DOCTOR HATTON:
Q. Let me just ask, Mrs. Douglas, if you were elected to today whom would you turn to for assistance to learn the things that you would have to know to be a good commissioner?
A. From the information that I have been able to gather through the Annual Report from the South Carolina Public Service Commission, I see that there is a very -- there are several divisions that would lend that technical assistance that would be needed in making decisions and working through that process.
Q. You expect that the guide, their data gathering and information gathering, worked by establishing a direction as a commissioner and you would need some other consultative help, wouldn't you, to do that?
A. Absolutely.
REPRESENTATIVE QUINN: Any other questions? Ms. Douglas, we appreciate your time and your patience. I thank you for being here. I guess that about wraps it up and you can go now and have a good weekend.

Printed Page 2643 . . . . . Thursday, February 24, 1994
PERSONAL DATA QUESTIONNAIRE SUMMARY

1. Ms. Mary Gail Douglas
Home Address: Business Address:

Route 1 Box 58-B 210 E. Washington St.
Winnsboro, SC 29180 Winnsboro, SC 29180

2. She was born in Fairfield County, South Carolina on January 19, 1950.
Social Security Number: ***-**-****

3. S.C. Driver's License Number: *******
S.C. Voter Registration Number: 1 092 678

4. She was married to Jerry Walton Douglas on April 18, 1969. She has two children: Bradley Walton Douglas, age 22, (recently graduated from U.S.C. in Criminal Justice); and Jarrett Lyle Douglas, age 17, student.

6. She attended the University from South Carolina from 1968 to 1971 earning an A.D. in Nursing.

9. She worked from 1971 to 1980 as a staff and charge nurse at Fairfield Memorial Hospital. She has worked from 1980 until the present as the Executive Director of the Fairfield County Council on Aging.

19. As the Executive Director of the Fairfield County Council on Aging she is responsible for the management of the budget, operations, policy, compliance with federal regulations, and the development of services for older adults.

26. She is a member of these professional organizations: S.C. Association of Council on Aging Directors, (Secretary 1983-85, President 1988-89); National Association of Councils on Aging; Association of Transportation, Board Member; Blue Ridge Institute for Southern Community, Services Executive, (registration elect and board member).

27. Civic, charitable, etc. organizations: First Baptist Church, Sunday school teacher for college and career age, Winnsboro, S.C.;

Printed Page 2644 . . . . . Thursday, February 24, 1994
American Cancer Society; Richard Winn Academy, PTO, Booster Club, and Board Member; Local Chamber of Commerce; Fairfield Area Citizens Task Force, Department of Youth Services, volunteer; Detention Center, volunteer pianist; parent sponsor for Prom Promise.

29. Five letters of reference:
(a) Steve Breakfield

Banker, Bank of Ridgeway
P.0. Box 888
Winnsboro, SC 29180
(803) 635-5500
(b) Tom Reece
Executive Director, Senior Action, Inc.
402 E. McBee Ave.
Greenville, SC 29601-2935
(803) 467-3660
(c) Isadore E. Lourie
1224 Pickens Street
Columbia, SC 29211
(803) 799-9805
(d) Bonnie Brice
Route 4
Winnsboro, SC 29180
(803) 635-2010
(e) John Martin
Attorney
120 North Vanderhorst Street
Winnsboro, SC 29180
(803) 635-4912

30. Fifth District

MR. COUICK: Can we stand adjourned, Mr. Chairman?
A. Could I ask a question.
REPRESENTATIVE QUINN: Certainly.
A. What happens next?
REPRESENTATIVE QUINN: Mr. Couick will get you some information on that. I guess that wraps it up for us, too.

(The proceedings adjourned at 4:15 p.m.)

Printed Page 2645 . . . . . Thursday, February 24, 1994
Monday, January 24, 1994
10:00 a.m. - 4:35 p.m.
THE CHAIRMAN: I thank all of you for coming this morning. There are -- some of the members of the committee will be in a little bit later. We are tracking them. But if we're going to go through the process we have planned for today, we're going to have to start.

I will introduce to you Mr. Mike Couick who is general counsel for this committee. He's got a few remarks he'd like to make to all of you. I think first is he's going to see how many of the candidates are here.
MR. COUICK: Mr. Chairman, we would like to call more or less a roll and see who is present. Mr. Hall, I believe, is present. You've reviewed your PDQ summary; is that correct, Mr. Hall?
MR. HALL: Yes, sir.
MR. COUICK: Mr. Arthur, have you had an opportunity to review your PDQ summary?
MR. ARTHUR: Yes, sir.
MR. COUICK: Mr. Blackburn. Have you had reviewed yours, Mr. Blackburn?
MR. BLACKBURN: Yes, sir.
MR. COUICK: Mr. Cannon?
MR. CANNON: Yes, sir.
MR. COUICK: All right. Mr. Cannon, they did decide to accept your application. You and I had chatted on the phone.
MR. CANNON: Pardon?
MR. COUICK: They received your application. I believe it was just a day late, but the committee voted last week to receive it and allow you to apply.
MR. CANNON: Thank you.
MR. COUICK: Have you reviewed your PDQ Summary, Mr. Cannon?
MR. CANNON: Yes, sir.
MR. COUICK: Ms. Dawes?
MS. DAWES: Yes.
MR. COUICK: Have you reviewed your summary?
MS. DAWES: Yes, I have.
MR. COUICK: Mr. Ganaway?
MR. GANAWAY: Yes, sir.
MR. COUICK: Mr. Ganaway, the committee voted last week to allow you to amend the district for which you had run, so you will now be running in District One.
MR. GANAWAY: Yes, sir. Thank you, sir.
MR. COUICK: Thank you. Mr. Lambert?

Printed Page 2646 . . . . . Thursday, February 24, 1994
MR. LAMBERT: Yes, sir.
MR. COUICK: Mr. Lambert, have you reviewed your PDQ Summary?
MR. LAMBERT: Yes, sir.
MR. COUICK: Mr. Smith. Mr. Smith, have you reviewed yours?
MR. SMITH: I have.
MR. COUICK: Mr. Hundley?
MR. HUNDLEY: Yes, I've reviewed mine also.
MR. COUICK: Thank you. Mr. Ingram?
MR. INGRAM: Here.
MR. COUICK: And, finally, Mr. Mitchell.

Mr. Chairman, the committee has decided -- the decision last week that all candidates should be sequestered during the pendency of the hearings except when they're testifying.

At this time, we'd like to ask everyone except for Mr. Hall to please go to room 201. Someone will come up and get you shortly. For those candidates after Mr. Cannon including Ms. Dawes there forward on the list, it's going to be sometime before you're called.

If you want to take a break, enjoy yourself or enjoy the city, you're welcome to do that. That would be Ms. Dawes, Mr. Ganaway, Mr. Lambert, Mr. Smith, Mr. Hundley, Mr. Ingram and Mr. Mitchell. I would anticipate that it would at least be an hour before we got to Ms. Dawes. The first four candidates we would take up fairly shortly. Thank you.

Our first candidate this morning is Mr. Richard Atkinson Hall from Chester, South Carolina. Mr. Hall, if you would raise your right hand and take the oath.
RICHARD ATKINSON HALL, having been duly sworn, testified as follows:
MR. HALL - EXAMINATION BY MR. COUICK:
Q. Mr. Hall, I'm reviewing your driver's license now. It indicates that you live at Route 4, Box 618, Chester, South Carolina. Your voter registration card indicates the same address. Mr. Hall, is that a Chester County address?
A. Yes.
Q. Thank you. Mr. Hall, you've applied for the Public Service Commission for the Fifth District. Could you please tell the committee what has made you apply? What are your reasons for applying to serve on the commission?
A. It's a new direction. I've been involved with utility companies all my working life. It's just a new direction, a new field.

Printed Page 2647 . . . . . Thursday, February 24, 1994
Q. You -- in fact, you mentioned you had been involved with utility companies. You worked with, I believe, Duke Power for a while; is that correct?
A. That's correct.
Q. Do you have any ownership of any utility stock whether it be Duke Power?
A. My wife has stock in the Chester Telephone Company now.
Q. And that telephone company would be regulated by the Public Service Commission?
A. That's correct.
Q. What would be your intention as to that stock if you were to be elected?
A. Whatever is necessary.
Q. Would that include if you needed to sell it, you would sell it?
A. I don't believe my wife wants to sell it, but that would be up to ya'll.
Q. Well, if I were to tell you that as a regulated utility, you or any member of your household, it would be frowned upon, in fact, prohibited from owning stock in a company that you regulate, would that cause you a problem? I mean I just want to let you know you up front that would be the rule. Would that be a problem?
A. Well, now, I'd have to ask my wife that.
Q. Okay.
A. She inherited it from her father.
Q. Right.
A. And I don't really know. I'd just have to ask her about that.
Q. I just bring that to your attention. Is there any other utility stock that you own?
A. No.
Q. Do you receive a pension or any type of deferred compensation from Duke Power from your work with them?
A. No. Huh-uh.
Q. You also serve on -- as a director of the Chester County Natural Gas Authority?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. What would be your intention as to that --
A. I'd have to resign.
Q. You own and operate your own real estate company there in Chester?
A. Yes, sir.
Printed Page 2648 . . . . . Thursday, February 24, 1994
Q. The Richard Hall Real Estate Company. Would you continue to own or operate the whole or part of that company?
A. Yes.
Q. Do you rent, lease or have you on occasion sold property to a regulated utility? Do you do business with regulated utilities?
A. Not to my knowledge. I may -- I think I sold a lot maybe 15 years ago to the natural gas company for the town.
Q. Do you at any time sell undeveloped property owned by SCANA or Duke Power or Crescent Land or Timber (phonetic)?
A. No.
Q. Timber or anything like that?
A. No.
Q. What type of rules would you adopt to make sure that there wouldn't be a conflict of interest, Mr. Hall?
A. For myself?
Q. For yourself and that business if you were to be elected?
A. Just have to make sure that there would never be a conflict of interest. And I understand that if I regulate a utility company or phone company or whatever, I can't be involved in ownership or any management decisions because, obviously, it would be a conflict of interest.
Q. Yes, sir. Mr. Hall, how much time would you anticipate putting into your service on the Public Service Commission versus the time that you would anticipate putting into your real estate business?
A. Mostly I'm in property management and I have people there that would do my work for me, really. I'm in land development.
Q. Okay.
A. I buy and sell land. I do very little house selling. So actually I'm in rental properties.
Q. The rental property that you do is it commercial or residential?
A. Some commercial, some residential.
Q. Mostly in Chester County?
A. Chester County, yes, sir.
Q. Mr. Hall, you've received a copy of your PDQ Summary. I believe you noted there were a couple of typographical errors?
A. Yes.
Q. Could you hand those up to Ms. Hammond now and we'll, with your permission, enter that on the record of these proceedings?
A. Just some misspelled words. I'm not sure my wife would like that. They were her name.
Printed Page 2649 . . . . . Thursday, February 24, 1994
Q. Mr. Chairman, we've had an opportunity to review Mr. Hall's credit report, also his report from SLED. Both were negative in the sense that there were no negative entries entered on the reports.

Mr. Hall, what would you think would be the one or two most pressing issues facing the Public Service Commission at this time?
A. Well, obviously, right now with this fiberoptics, cable TV, just a lot of interesting things and I think challenging things that are going to take place and --
Q. In the area of fiberoptics, what would you see to be the shape of the problem that could be controlled by the Public Service Commission?
A. Well, since they are regulated monopolies, there is always the possibility. And, of course, with any monopoly, there is the possibility of some, I would say -- I wouldn't say fraud, but -- unless they have someone to quote look at them.
Q. And they being who?
A. Phone companies, cable companies, I think, have a monopoly type situation when they buy their franchises.
Q. If you were to be elected to the commission, would you consider yourself to be more of a consumer activist or more of a status quo conservative industry type or how would you --
A. Well, I certainly understand the need for a utility company to make a profit. I understand that they have to raise the capital. I would be a consumer advocate and hopefully I could -- obviously, they would make presentations as to what they needed and make decisions based on those presentations. I understand that there is a staff over there and -- about 150 people in it. I'm sure they would give us all the data that we need on both sides.
Q. Let me read through some terms if I might, Mr. Hall, and ask if you're familiar with them. The concept of wheeling, wholesale wheeling?
A. Wholesale wheeling, I'm not familiar with the term.
Q. How about generational mix in terms of the production of power?
A. Generational mix.
Q. Generational mix?
A. Does that mean the use of coal and gas --
Q. Yes, sir.
A. -- and water --
Q. Exactly.
A. -- to produce power.
Q. You mentioned the PSC staff. What role would the staff play with you? What would you allow them to do to help you?

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